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Cold Weather Package for Moderate Climates

Discussion in 'Reserving, Ordering, Production, Delivery' started by Kizzy, Nov 21, 2016.

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  1. Kizzy

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    #1 Kizzy, Nov 21, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2016
    Temperature range in my area has winter lows from the mid 30s to mid 40s Fahrenheit, usually on the higher end of the range. We have lots of condensation, rarely frost during winter. When I got my current ICE car (Honda Accord), I was a bit envious of my Canadian neighbors getting heated mirrors standard (per my user manual) as clearing them by hand on the fly generally leaves a spotty mess.

    Do any of you in a similar climate currently have heated mirrors or a desire for a cold weather package? I don't think it's absolutely needed in my case, but I get cold during the winter and would not be unhappy with heated seats/steering wheel (especially if they were more efficient to use than the heater).
     
  2. TrevP

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    @Kizzy it's way less taxing on energy consumption to heat the seats and steering wheel than heat the cabin. I'd say it's worth it if you need to take the edge off on the colder days, especially if you're in a situation when you need range and haven't or don't have the ability to charge for some length of time. Heating the cabin is best when done with pre-heating while on shore power but that's not always possible, especially while away on a trip. A cold-soaked battery requires quite a bit of energy to heat up.

    I'm in the Toronto area which enjoys usually milder winter temps due to the lake effect (Buffalo just across the lake gets slammed really hard in the winter) but I can say without question that the cold weather package is a must for us and the all-glass roof is a welcome thing in the grey dreary days of winter. Summers here can be excruciatingly hot due to the humidity.
     
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    • MelindaV

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      @Kizzy Our weather here is similar here, maybe a little colder in the winter and I have one car with heated mirrors and one without. I can not say I've noticed a difference between the two in regards to the mirrors being heated or not.
      And for what it's worth, from what I can tell, on the Model S, the heated mirrors are not part if the cold weather package but standard.
      Cold weather package adds heated wipers, steering wheel and rear seats. (Front seat heat standard)
      For me, it's not worth it. I rarely will have people in the back seat, I've never had my wipers complain about being cold and so the only part of the cold weather package that is appealing at all is the steering wheel, but not for the price of the package.
       
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      • pjfw8

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        a heated steering wheel was included on my current car. I thought is was stupid until I tried it. It is a great feature. Great when it is cold but even useful on long trips. Nevertheless, not worth the cost in North Carolina!
         
      • Kizzy

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        Thanks for those answers, folks. They were helpful.

        (FYI, I edited my original post to indicate the temperature scale I was using for my numbers.)
         
      • Michael Russo

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        Thanks for this 'hot' advice, Trev! :p
         
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        • MichelT3

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          Me too, though I'm still unsure whether this package is useful for The Netherlands. Well, we just have to wait how M3 will be equipped standard. And what the price will be for the package.
           
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          • Dgodfrey

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            I'm somewhat shocked that a heat pump isn't standard equipment or at least a part of the cold weather package. It uses a lot less energy than all resistant heat until you get below about 25F.
             
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            • Red Sage

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              As I understand the concept, heat pumps are only efficient in a narrow range of specific circumstances. Once you go above a certain temperature, or below another, it is either ineffective or doesn't work at all. Sort of like the various HFCEV and aluminum air battery projects, but not quite as bad. The resistant heating elements are to my knowledge practically an instant on solution. I would presume a lot of energy consumed in a short period of time to get the desired result is considered more efficient from a certain point of view. I've come to really like seat heaters myself.
               
            • AlexanderFromGermany

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              My Zoe has a heat pump and it generates a lot of noise if working on maximum power. It is also more complex than an electric heater. Maybe that is why Tesla do not use a heat pump.
               
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              • KennethK

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                Heat pumps lose efficiency as ambient temperature drops to the point that at about 20F they are equivalent to resistance heating. That is true on the system in the i3 BEV.
                 
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                • Dgodfrey

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                  Agreed, heat pumps are more efficient than resistant heat in the sweet spot of about 20-25F on up when they eventually reverse cycle and expel heat from the air for air conditioning. Below that temp, the resistant heater does the grunt work. That was my point. On many existing EV's, they use both the resistant heat for extreme cold and the heat pump handles the majority from 20F on up. On the Tesla model s, as far as I know they don't use a heat pump at all for heating, only resistant heat. When the Leaf added the heat pump in 2013 in conjunction to the existing resistant heater, it was a major improvement to the cold weather range. I'm hoping that Tesla follows this thinking with the model 3. I'm not sure but I believe the air conditioner in the Tesla is just a heat pump anyway, just allow access to it (reverse cycle) when heat is needed above 20F.
                   
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                  • KennethK

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                    It is a benefit to use the heat pump, no doubt. In fact I, too, would like one. For example, geothermal system use a reversing valve to switch from heating to cooling. They are just big air conditioners.

                    I'm thinking that Tesla has something special planned for the model 3, since they have a new ventilation system for the vehicle. This is going to be interesting to see.
                     
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                    • MichelT3

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                      Isn't there a different situation concerning effectivity of different heating systems between charging, standing not charging, and driving?
                       
                    • Dgodfrey

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                      Michel;
                      I don't know for certain if the status of the car effects which heating system is used when both the heat pump and resistant heat is available. On my Leaf, I pre-heat while in my garage which rarely gets below freezing even when below 0 outside so it probably uses the heat pump until I open the garage door and drive away. At that point, the resistant heat would take over if it's below around 20F. I'll try to listen to it next time to see if I can hear a difference.
                      On a related note, I questioned why you couldn't just use the existing heat pump in the Tesla that is used for air conditioning for the heating chores but I realized on my Leaf that when I turn on the defroster, both the heat and a/c buttons light up simultaneously. I don't think one heat pump could do both at the same time. So it's probably not as easy as I thought to just utilize the existing hardware in the Tesla to add the heat pump efficiency.
                       
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                      • garsh

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                        Instead of listening, change the display to show energy info, and pay attention to the "climate control" gauge.

                        [​IMG]
                         

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