False Forward Collision Warning

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MrMatt

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#1
Anyone else getting Forward Collision Warnings when there is no imminent danger? My neighbor's car is parked on the street and I pass it every day and about ~4 times so far in the last 2 weeks since we've had the car, the collision warning sounds and freaks me out. I'm not close to it and not heading towards it and its not moving and i'm only go 25mph. And then today, driving, the alarm sounded and there was no car there. I don't have a lot of faith in this system, but i don't wanna turn it off......

I also notice that it does not detect bikers and does not handle large vehicles (buses and tractor trailers) well at all (it just shows them as other cars). Plus when i'm stopped in first position at a light and there is cross traffic, it seems to think those cars are heading parallel to me and get's all confused and moves the cars sideways! Anyone else see that too?

I expected more from this system with all the hype. I only have free Autopilot, not enhanced.
 

Dogwhistle

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#3
I also notice that it does not detect bikers and does not handle large vehicles (buses and tractor trailers) well at all (it just shows them as other cars). Plus when i'm stopped in first position at a light and there is cross traffic, it seems to think those cars are heading parallel to me and get's all confused and moves the cars sideways! Anyone else see that too?

I expected more from this system with all the hype. I only have free Autopilot, not enhanced.
I believe this is just a limitation with the current rendering software. Right now, autopilot can only show obstacles as other Teslas facing parallel to your direction of travel. Bikers, trucks, pedestrians, they’re all Teslas. What’s really amusing is to sit at a stop in the front position with pedestrians walking in front of you. Mine shows a bunch of cars sliding sideways across my path! I think this will change in future updates/improvements to the system.
 

Dogwhistle

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#4
Anyone else getting Forward Collision Warnings when there is no imminent danger? My neighbor's car is parked on the street and I pass it every day and about ~4 times so far in the last 2 weeks since we've had the car, the collision warning sounds and freaks me out. I'm not close to it and not heading towards it and its not moving and i'm only go 25mph. And then today, driving, the alarm sounded and there was no car there. I don't have a lot of faith in this system, but i don't wanna turn it off......
In your case, since you are getting a bunch of false warnings, you might want to set the system to “Late” notification to try and get rid of them.


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msjulie

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#5
Mine has startled me on multiple occasions - nothing imminent though. My guess is that if you accelerate when the car in front (even if pretty far away) is not, it thinks maybe you're going to ram it... basing that on a couple of yellow light moderate accelerations.. but it's a guess cause it's done it to me when there's nothing dangerous nearby..
 
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#6
I had mine on late collision warning since delivery didn't have any false positives. On my current road trip I set it to the middle selection (can't remember how they label them) and got a few false positives. So I'll be setting it back to late.
 

3V Pilot

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#7
Mine has been set to "Early" since I've owned the car, thought I would try it out and thought I would have to reduce the setting. That said I think I've only triggered it once and I knew I was approaching a car rather quickly. If you have that many false readings I'd get the system checked by Tesla to make sure the sensors are properly wired and calibrated.
 

ateslik

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#8
I have to drive up a long hill with multiple stop signs to get to work. Sometimes if I’m driving too fast approaching a car in front of me waiting at the sign the alarm will sound even though I am nowhere near close to a collision. If the ground was flat and I was appoaching that fast then mabye. My guess is the collision warning is a calculation of your current speed (distance / time) compared to the available distance to the object in front of you and the time it takes to stop in that distance. When you exceed a threshold where the time required to stop is close to the time it takes to travel that distance it triggers. But it should also take into account the grade of travel in my opinion, since a steep grade helps stopping a lot.

Still makes me piss my pants almost everytime though, dammit.
 

Kizzy

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#9
[…]My guess is the collision warning is a calculation of your current speed (distance / time) compared to the available distance to the object in front of you and the time it takes to stop in that distance. When you exceed a threshold where the time required to stop is close to the time it takes to travel that distance it triggers. But it should also take into account the grade of travel in my opinion, since a steep grade helps stopping a lot.[…]
Sounds like great feedback. Have you filed a bug report?
 

Bernard

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#10
Mine has startled me on multiple occasions - nothing imminent though. My guess is that if you accelerate when the car in front (even if pretty far away) is not, it thinks maybe you're going to ram it... basing that on a couple of yellow light moderate accelerations.. but it's a guess cause it's done it to me when there's nothing dangerous nearby..
Same here, but it has actually done emergency braking on me because it did not realize the road was curving sharply and saw the car coming in the opposite direction emerging from the curve as a car crossing my path at a very short distance. That was rather a shock (and I was lucky nobody was behind me, since they could easily have hit me), so I've learned to disable EAP on any road with sharp turns...
For now, it seems to be aimed strictly at driving on divided highways.
 

KarenRei

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#11
It's important to note that this is not unique to Tesla. False positives are a huge challenge in collision warning / AEB systems. Uber shut off their cars' factory AEB systems (leading to the fatal crash in Arizona) because they felt it was giving too many false positives.
 
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Charlie W

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#12
Is there a volume control for warning beeps/bongs (or whatever you call the warning) tones the Model 3 makes?

The other day while my wife & I were driving to a friend's home, I had our Model 3 on Traffic Aware Cruise Control (i.e., I was steering; the car was more or less determining the speed). We were enjoying a quiet country-side drive -- no radio; no conversation at that moment -- UNTIL all of a sudden, an oncoming car made a left-hand-turn, crossing in front of us, and turning onto a side-street. Although I didn't see it as a problem and no emergency braking was needed, our Model 3 disagreed. It let out a LOUD series of about 8 beeps/bongs/or whatever you want to call them, to alert me to the situation. Not only did the loud warning scare the bejeebies out of my wife, but it didn't help with her acceptance of the day when Full Self Driving comes about. It also made me wonder if there is a way to lower the volume -- not turn it off, after all, it does serve an important safety function, but just turn it down just a bit.

~Charlie
 

Dogwhistle

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#13
I had three very strong false-positive braking events on one 300 mile trip with my wife, scared the crap out of her and made her motion sick to boot. We were doing 75, and the car pretty much went into max braking with no one in front of us. She was pretty ticked and now I’m not allowed to have cruise control, let alone autopilot, engaged with her in the car. The benefits of the system are being lost by these pretty significant flaws, really hope it gets sorted.

The errors seem to occur going up hill with an overpass located towards the crest of the hill, putting the overpass towards road level as the car looks forward. Lots of those in western Maryland.
 

Bernard

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#14
I had three very strong false-positive braking events on one 300 mile trip with my wife, scared the crap out of her and made her motion sick to boot. We were doing 75, and the car pretty much went into max braking with no one in front of us. She was pretty ticked and now I’m not allowed to have cruise control, let alone autopilot, engaged with her in the car. The benefits of the system are being lost by these pretty significant flaws, really hope it gets sorted.

The errors seem to occur going up hill with an overpass located towards the crest of the hill, putting the overpass towards road level as the car looks forward. Lots of those in western Maryland.
Similar errors also occur using TACC, triggering braking, although not necessarily emergency braking:
(i) Approaching a large box-like object on the side of the road (such as a "this is your speed" radar display).
(ii) Strong shadows that extend across your lane and are sufficiently broad (not a lamppost, but a large tree or small building --- or an overpass ;-).
(iii) Any car crossing the road at some distance in front of you (coming from the left to enter your lane well ahead of you, coming from the right to enter the opposite lane, again well ahead of you) -- or just appearing to be crossing the road in front of you but actually coming out of a sharp curve in the road; etc., etc.
In all of these cases, no driver would feel the need to slow down, but each time TACC decided to slow down, presumably because its estimate of possible outcomes if maintaining speed included collision and it used a "better safe than sorry" approach.
In a couple of cases, it triggered emergency braking -- annoying, but no harm for me and my passenger, except that I worried in such cases about getting rear-ended, since the driver behind me would certainly not expect me to brake, much less brake very hard.

The more I drive my Model 3, the less I use any automation, including TACC. It's such a pleasure to drive anyway that I'd rather do all of the driving myself -- and it's almost more tiring to keep my foot hovering over the pedals than to actually use the pedals. I use cruise control mostly to set an upper limit when going downhill.
I'll revisit that approach when version 9 of the firmware gets installed -- I hope it will be better at handling intersections and sharp curves.
 

PNWmisty

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#15
Emergency braking has triggered one time on me in three months (and a real collision was imminent). I had Auto-pilot engaged going down main street at about 30 mph. There was one lane in either direction, a center turn lane, cars parallel parked on both curbs and a lot of side streets and curb cuts for stores. A big box truck was mostly blocking the view of a car on my right, coming out of a parking lot and trying to cross my path while turning left. I could see the cars wheels under the box truck as it pulled up and stopped, ready to enter traffic. I knew they probably couldn't see me due to the box truck and I thought, "no, don't pull in front of me". Then they started to dart in front of me in a manner where I was sure to hit them broadside if I took no action. Since I was only going 30 mph and I could see the pavement was clean and dry, I covered the brake without pressing on it. My plan was to see if the AP would react but I was ready to stomp on the brakes the last second and stop in time. Right before I stepped on the brake the AEB jammed them on HARD for me. Since the other car continued to accelerate hard, I was able to step back on the throttle before the cars some distance behind me had to brake. But, had the AEB or myself not taken any action, we would have broadsided them at 30 mph in a typical urban collision. I know AP is not for such environments but I like to push its limits while keeping close tabs on it.

So I can confirm AEB really works. I've never had a heavy braking event that was unnecessary but AP will often slow down by coming off the accelerator or doing mild regenerative braking in urban situations when it's not really warranted. If I ease on the accelerator manually in these situations, the AP will take over and keep accelerating to the set speed. It's like I'm coaching it, saying, "It's OK Panda, thanks for being careful but carry on".
 

3V Pilot

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#16
Emergency braking has triggered one time on me in three months (and a real collision was imminent). I had Auto-pilot engaged going down main street at about 30 mph. There was one lane in either direction, a center turn lane, cars parallel parked on both curbs and a lot of side streets and curb cuts for stores. A big box truck was mostly blocking the view of a car on my right, coming out of a parking lot and trying to cross my path while turning left. I could see the cars wheels under the box truck as it pulled up and stopped, ready to enter traffic. I knew they probably couldn't see me due to the box truck and I thought, "no, don't pull in front of me". Then they started to dart in front of me in a manner where I was sure to hit them broadside if I took no action. Since I was only going 30 mph and I could see the pavement was clean and dry, I covered the brake without pressing on it. My plan was to see if the AP would react but I was ready to stomp on the brakes the last second and stop in time. Right before I stepped on the brake the AEB jammed them on HARD for me. Since the other car continued to accelerate hard, I was able to step back on the throttle before the cars some distance behind me had to brake. But, had the AEB or myself not taken any action, we would have broadsided them at 30 mph in a typical urban collision. I know AP is not for such environments but I like to push its limits while keeping close tabs on it.

So I can confirm AEB really works. I've never had a heavy braking event that was unnecessary but AP will often slow down by coming off the accelerator or doing mild regenerative braking in urban situations when it's not really warranted. If I ease on the accelerator manually in these situations, the AP will take over and keep accelerating to the set speed. It's like I'm coaching it, saying, "It's OK Panda, thanks for being careful but carry on".
I'm glad you posted a positive review of the system. I've had my car since April and in 8000 miles of driving, mostly on Autopilot, I've only had 1 AEB activation, and it happened when it should of. I set my warning to "Early" on day one and assumed I'd need to dial it back. It's been there ever since and very rarely has it ever gone off. Yes, I get that under autopilot the car will brake if someone makes a left turn in front of me, I just apply a little accelerator pedal to keep that from happening. I think the whole system works great, with some understanding that it's not perfect, but then again I can understand it may not be enough to make others happy with how it reacts. I'm looking forward to version 9 and hoping that things improve but even if it didn't get any better than the current state, it's still WAY better than anything else out there and I'm glad I have it!
 

Dale Gardner

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#17
Finally disabled the forward collision warning a week ago. My sanity has been restored! Should have investigated this more a lot sooner. I looked through the settings a couple times and never found it. I don't have Autopilot, so I didn't know there would be any relevant settings in there. Also, it isn't obvious that the page can be scrolled down for more settings. :confused:

For my experience, I was averaging at least two alerts per drive. It was really stressing me out, and also frightening my passengers when present. :mad:

Similarly, I also disabled the parking warnings/beeping (but I did that the 2nd day having the car). I don't know how folks could stand trying to park with that cacophony of beeping going on. :oops: Way too stressful and annoying. :rolleyes:

I'm starting to wonder if the car's warnings are set too aggressively by default. New owners will not be accustomed to the warnings and tend to panic, since the beeps are very loud and usually difficult to ascertain the cause of the alert. Trying to park in a garage can sound like you're in a fire drill. o_O Many new owners may be coming from a car which provides no such warning beeps. Or just the standard reverse parking proximity tone. It can be a rude awakening for sure. :)
 

Mistersandman

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#19
I get the forward collision notification EVERY time I drive in my neighborhood. It’s always when the street has a slight curve to it and there are cars parked on the curb on my right. I recognize that my situation is a difficult one to assess accurately but it sure does freak out the passengers. Other than my neighborhood it has worked pretty reliably and saved me a few times. I’m set to medium.
 

PNWmisty

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#20
I get the forward collision notification EVERY time I drive in my neighborhood. It’s always when the street has a slight curve to it and there are cars parked on the curb on my right. I recognize that my situation is a difficult one to assess accurately but it sure does freak out the passengers. Other than my neighborhood it has worked pretty reliably and saved me a few times. I’m set to medium.
Have you tried setting it to "Late"? I can't stand false alarms and this setting has been working great for me.