MPP Model 3 Sports Coilovers Dual Motor/Performance/P+ PRE-ORDER SPECIAL

  • If you haven't taken delivery yet or plan on ordering you can still get the 6 months of FREE Supercharging only until December 17th all Model 3s now qualify! Call or email your Tesla delivery advisor and give them our code

MountainPass

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 15, 2018
Messages
214
Location
Toronto, Ontario
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#21
I will be going with slightly lower than stock. Roads are bad and parking lot turtles are even worst.

MMP, can both rebound and compression adjustment be made while the coilover is installed on the car?
Yes, it is especially easy if you don't lower the car much. In the front, we made 2 very small holes in the frunk plastic to put an allen key through to adjust the front dampers. You could also just remove the frunk plastic to do that if you don't want holes, it takes me about 3 minutes to remove that.
 

modelo tres

Active Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2018
Messages
25
Location
St Petersburg
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#22
Just curious,

I saw your video on YouTube of the development process for the RWD coilovers. I like how extensive your research was into getting everything right and the testimonials are showing for it.

Did you guys do just as much research and development into these AWD coilovers with the different weight distribution and different handling characteristics of the AWD Model 3s?

Thank you

I'm just about ready to put a deposit down.
 

JeffC

Top-Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
539
Location
Silicon Valley
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#23
Obviously Sasha can answer better than I can, but the difference between dual motor and single motor Model 3s is about 120 kg for the front drivetrain (motor/geabox/controller), so the suspension tuning would only be very slightly different between them. Call it about 6% more weight low and up front at the front axle.

There's even some evidence that Tesla may use similar springs or dampers in both single motor and dual motor cars, aside from the slightly shorter springs in the Performance version. The differences in mass and its distribution are pretty small.
 
Last edited:

beastmode13

Active Member
M3OC Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
116
Location
Mountain View, CA
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#24
Obviously Sasha can answer better than I can, but the difference between dual motor and single motor Model 3s is about 120 kg for the front drivetrain (motor/geabox/controller), so the suspension tuning would only be very slightly different between them. Call it about 6% more weight low and up front at the front axle.

There's even some evidence that Tesla may use similar springs or dampers in both single motor and dual motor cars, aside from the slightly shorter springs in the Performance version. The differences in mass and its distrobution are pretty small.
Static distribution difference is small, but dynamic distribution differences will be much higher due to harder acceleration of Performance model.
 

modelo tres

Active Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2018
Messages
25
Location
St Petersburg
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#25
Thank you beastmode13; that is exactly my point.

There is so much more to it than just the difference in weight distribution, which is exactly why I asked my original question.
 

JeffC

Top-Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
539
Location
Silicon Valley
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#27
FWIW I believe Sasha did indicate earlier that the tuning of the front coilovers would be slightly different for the dual motor cars, due to the bit of added mass up front. But that was a preliminary thought; will need to see what he ends up with.
 

beastmode13

Active Member
M3OC Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
116
Location
Mountain View, CA
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#28
To add a bit of color to the dynamic weight shift during braking and acceleration. With stock P3D+ even during spirited driving within the legal speed limit of the roads, when accelerating hard and turning, I can feel the front end lighten to the point that it would require slight steering adjustment to maintain the same turning arc. However, in most instances, the electronic wizardry (vectoring of motor output and braking) would kick in to tame the understeer.

However, I'm looking to utilize the MPP coilover to lower the ride height a bit and stiffening up the compression and rebound to provide better control of weight transfer that impacts steering that triggers electronic wizardry. The electronic wizardry generates extra heat in the motor/battery system on Model3 and brake system. From what I have read so far, overheating the motor/battery system is the number one reason and most difficult challenge for Model 3 on the track. So having a track-tuned suspension setup might help reduce the heat burden while on the track.
 

JeffC

Top-Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
539
Location
Silicon Valley
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#29
To add a bit of color to the dynamic weight shift during braking and acceleration. With stock P3D+ even during spirited driving within the legal speed limit of the roads, when accelerating hard and turning, I can feel the front end lighten to the point that it would require slight steering adjustment to maintain the same turning arc. However, in most instances, the electronic wizardry (vectoring of motor output and braking) would kick in to tame the understeer.
All powerful cars do this to some extent. Some have more power than suspension. It was particularly bad on a very early Model S P85 I drove without the + suspension upgrade. In other words, it had the stock, full soft suspension, and even with a possible anti-squat suspension, it transferred so much load off the front wheels under full power acceleration that the front end got very light and wanted to wander around. A 2018 Model S P100DL I drove had a much more competent suspension for its power.

So some of what you're describing is simply the physics of load transfer. Hard acceleration will transfer load off the front of the car and onto the rear. Shorter or stiffer springs or firmer dampers do help though. Model 3 (including the Peformance version) does have relatively tall springs, but as I've pointed out elsewhere, having a longer suspension travel is beneficial in handling large bumps and dips of real world roads better. There is always a tradeoff between ride and handling, and Tesla did an extremely good job with all of the Model 3 variants. I very much agree with the Tesla engineer who said during the Road & Track review of Model 3 track mode:

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/a22625274/tesla-model-3-performance-track-test/
"It's easy to make a car that handles well. But if you want to make it go over bumps and ride well, be comfortable, that is really difficult to do," Lars Moravy, Director of Chassis Engineering tells me trackside. "We worked long and hard to make it be able to go around the track fast, be agile, be responsive, but not shatter your teeth out."
(Looking at you BMW M3 in track mode....)

Some people complain about the Model 3 wheel to fender gap on aesthetic grounds, but it looks fine to me and has functional benefits.

BTW the way to tame understeer is to take a different line and manage the torque and velocity differently throughout a turn. Slow in, fast out. Small, gradual adjustments to the controls, including throttle. See racing school. :)

That said, if I get Sasha's coilovers I will definitely run them a little lower than stock (say 1 inch lower than non-P == 15 mm lower than P) for street use, perhaps dropping even more for track use.

However, I'm looking to utilize the MPP coilover to lower the ride height a bit and stiffening up the compression and rebound to provide better control of weight transfer that impacts steering that triggers electronic wizardry. The electronic wizardry generates extra heat in the motor/battery system on Model3 and brake system. From what I have read so far, overheating the motor/battery system is the number one reason and most difficult challenge for Model 3 on the track. So having a track-tuned suspension setup might help reduce the heat burden while on the track.
The amount of energy/heat used by traction control is probably not significant for the battery pack/motors compared to the energy used to actually move the car, but the traction and stability controls do heat the (rear) brakes possibly significantly.

The good news is that the track mode *may* allow such large slip angles that more rational slip angles for fast lap times may trigger the traction control via brakes much less. (All of the videos of track mode seem to feature large, near-drifting slip angles, which as we know is slow around a race track. Smaller slip angles are faster around a race track.)
 
Last edited:

JeffC

Top-Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
539
Location
Silicon Valley
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#32
Can't really get any better to have Randy Pobst helping fine tuning Track Mode. - https://www.motortrend.com/cars/tes...erformance-track-mode-release-version-review/
Agree, and I like that he didn't like the heavy regen on throttle lift. If a racer wants oversteer, they can nudge the brakes. If they want the back end to rotate more into a turn, they can trail brake. Braking generally belongs on the brake pedal and not the throttle.

http://www.jeffchan.com/cars/ev/regen-on-throttle.html
 

JeffC

Top-Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2018
Messages
539
Location
Silicon Valley
Tesla Owner
Model 3
Country
Country
#35
Outrageous; they disqualified Cameron. Something about fuel. (The microphone and video cut out during the awards ceremony.)
 
Last edited: